INTERVIEW: Rep. August Pfluger on how the "conservative conscience of Congress" is navigating the Schumer Shutdown
Rep. August Pfluger lived through government shutdowns while serving in the military. Now he wants Democrats who served our country to join him in ending the Schumer Shutdown.
As Chairman of the Republican Study Committee (RSC), Rep. August Pfluger represents what he calls the “conservative conscience of Congress”; the RSC is the largest caucus of House Republicans, and under Pfluger’s leadership it now boasts a new podcast and a sprawling messaging apparatus.
Throughout the Schumer Shutdown, Pfluger and his caucus members have been everywhere; most recently, they jointly hosted a press conference with House GOP leadership and welcomed Speaker Mike Johnson (R., La.) and Majority Leader Steve Scalise (R., La.) on the Right to the Point Podcast, both of which were covered by the Washington Reporter.
Pfluger explained his new media approach in an interview with the Reporter: “the way that people receive information and where they go to find truth is now less and less from the mainstream media, and it’s more and more the people that they trust who will bring the facts to them,” he said. “And that’s why we choose to communicate through you and through others, because we know that there are millions of people who are so fed up with the ABCs and the CBSs and the NBCs that they just say ‘we’re not going to go there anymore, because we don’t believe what we’re being told.’ You can go to every interview that Mike Johnson has done with George Stephanopoulos and everybody else and see the spin.”
“We have thousands of followers after starting this from the ground,” Pfluger said of his growing podcast. “We started it this year, and they love the ability to go talk in a long form interview about the news of the day, the things that are happening, the legislation that they’re sponsoring, because they’re proud of it, and it’s good conservative policy that they’re able to talk about. That’s what the RSC really does well as we champion conservative policy, and we have the ear of the Speaker, who will be my next guest on this amazing podcast, and we’re able to go to him and say, ‘this is what your members are saying. This is what they want.’ Reconciliation was a perfect example of that. We pushed the Speaker and the Majority Leader and, quite frankly, the White House, in the direction of conservatism.”
Pfluger, a military veteran, has helped lead the GOP’s messaging throughout the shutdown about how it is damaging morale and readiness for American troops around the globe. He and over two dozen other RSC members recently wrote to Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D., N.Y.) about how the shutdown is devastating troops.
“When you look at a shutdown, that’s probably the most important aspect to notice: our readiness, our lethality, the effectiveness of our military, is impacted during a shutdown 100 percent,” he said. “The letter that we sent and have led on is to Chuck Schumer to say, rise up above petty politics and get back to the business of keeping our freaking country safe, because right now you’re impacting a million plus military families.”
For Pfluger, this is personal. “I was one of those families,” he explained. “I was there personally during shutdowns, and all we wanted was to do our job. And at that point in time, when the government shuts down, resources start going away, you start losing the ability to do your training and your exercises and, in some cases, real world missions. So that’s unacceptable. And for what? There are no conservative poison pills in this bill. It’s a clean CR; let’s get to the negotiating table by opening the government, and then we can talk about the other issues.”
While Pfluger was in the military, his wife asked him during one of the shutdowns “are we going to get a paycheck?” And his honest answer to her was “I don’t know,” and he was an officer with multiple years of service at the time.
“What about the soldier who’s deployed right now to the Middle East or to the Pacific or somewhere else, who has a new baby at home that is getting the same question like that?” he asked. “It is heartbreaking that our military personnel are having to answer that question to their spouses. How disrespectful is it of my Democrat colleagues to force them into that situation? Republicans didn’t do that right under Joe Biden. We wanted to end all of his his spending policies, but we did not shut down the government.”
Democrats like Rep. Katherine Clark (D., Mass.) have recently admitted that they view the shutdown as “leverage,” which Pfluger remarked upon — but he added that the dangers are far worse, both at home and abroad.
“Every day that this goes on makes it harder and harder for the bureaucracy to function, because in addition to the military not getting a paycheck, the people who work at the Department of Interior, they’re not getting a paycheck, and they’re the ones who approve these permits, and they’re the ones that approve the ability to have pipelines transit the country,” Pfluger explained. “So yes, it’s going to have an impact, just like not having a flood insurance policy so that you can close on a home somewhere is going to have an impact, just like those 42 million Americans that receive SNAP benefits are going to be worried about that. I was talking to a food bank today that services over 20 counties, and they’re very worried about the 55,000 people who come to that food bank, because these are real situations where, if that funding runs out, that food bank doesn’t have the resources to feed those people.”
For his district specifically, he predicted that SNAP and military pay are the two biggest problems in an ongoing shutdown. But the problems stretch beyond America’s borders, he added.
“Unfortunately,” Senate Democrats are “signaling our vulnerabilities and our weaknesses, and the weakness is in the ability for the radical sides of the parties to influence the adults in the room, and that’s exposing them to a tremendous amount of misinformation,” he said.
Pfluger added that he is “calling on my Democrat colleagues, especially those that served, to do the right thing, to stand up and do the right thing. And yes, that seems hard to do right now, but that’s the only way our country is going to heal: do the right thing to push back against that radical side.”
When does Pfluger predict the shutdown will end? “I don’t think it ends before November 1st,” he said. “I think it probably goes just prior to the mid-November pay period for the military.”
Below is a transcript of our interview with Rep. August Pfluger, lightly edited for clarity.
Washington Reporter:
During the shutdown, the RSC has been incredibly active when it comes to messaging. You recently sent a letter to Schumer from 27 military veterans and reservists in the RSC talking about the military impacts, specifically military readiness. Your team, trust me, is constantly pushing out messaging on facts about the shutdown more broadly and the Democrats’ narratives. Why do you think it’s important for the RSC specifically to be in this position of leadership on the Schumer Shutdown?
Rep. August Pfluger:
The RSC is a conservative conscience of Congress, and one of the conservative ideals that we have led on and will continue with is our national security. When you look at a shutdown, that’s probably the most important aspect to notice: our readiness, our lethality, the effectiveness of our military, is impacted during a shutdown 100 percent. The letter that we sent and have led on is to Chuck Schumer to say, rise up above petty politics and get back to the business of keeping our freaking country safe, because right now you’re impacting a million plus military families. I was one of those families. I was there personally during shutdowns, and all we wanted was to do our job. And at that point in time, when the government shuts down, resources start going away, you start losing the ability to do your training and your exercises and, in some cases, real world missions. So that’s unacceptable. And for what? There are no conservative poison pills in this bill. It’s a clean CR; let’s get to the negotiating table by opening the government, and then we can talk about the other issues.
Washington Reporter:
Throughout both the shutdown and even more broadly, since you took over this caucus, you’ve prioritized a lot of new media. We’re not that new of a media outlet. We’re almost two years old now. But as you’ve been talking with your colleagues who are in the RSC, as you’ve all been here and back in your districts around the country during the shutdown, I’ve seen them and you engage with a lot of less traditional media outlets. Why has that been a part of your strategy?
Rep. August Pfluger:
The way that people receive information and where they go to find truth is now less and less from the mainstream media, and it’s more and more the people that they trust who will bring the facts to them. And that’s why we choose to communicate through you and through others, because we know that there are millions of people who are so fed up with the ABCs and the CBSs and the NBCs that they just say ‘we’re not going to go there anymore, because we don’t believe what we’re being told.’ You can go to every interview that Mike Johnson has done with George Stephanopoulos and everybody else and see the spin. And when we sit down, you’re going to say the words and tell the facts instead of spinning it in a way. This is a new way to consume information.
Washington Reporter:
I’m seeing you don’t have any gray hair, which makes you one of the youngest people in Congress right off the bat. From your own media digest standpoint, how has that transformed for you, as you’ve gone about your military career and your congressional career? Is that an evolution that you yourself have dealt with, and now are in a position to kind of actualize on?
Rep. August Pfluger:
Absolutely. I grew up as a kid in middle school watching the Gulf War on CNN. It was very factual and information-based, and now it’s obviously transformed into radicalism. Most people now are choosing to read and consume and listen to sources that they trust.
Washington Reporter:
I listen to every RSC podcast because I’m the first person reporting on the upcoming episodes, and Mark Alford, in your most recent episode, said that there’s nothing to negotiate with Senate Democrats on this continuing resolution. Obviously, you run the largest Republican caucus in Congress; as you’ve been talking with your colleagues, is that the pulse check of where your members are all at? Or how are we thinking about this as you head into the second month of the shutdown?
Rep. August Pfluger:
Time is a factor that has to be considered in this. So I think that there probably a growing number of my colleagues who agree that there’s nothing to negotiate, but also look at the wasted time on the business at hand and have a desire to maybe get back to some of the hearings and do some of the other work. Let me also mention too that in becoming chairman of the Republican Study Committee, one of my goals was to leverage expertise. We have 189 members, 188 other people in addition to me, who are experts in something. That is why we have the podcast. I want to leverage them and their experiences on these questions that you’re asking me, because they each have a unique point of view and perspective, which is why our team really tries to put them in front of the camera as much as possible, to get their message out.
Washington Reporter:
Break that fourth wall for a second. What have you heard from your colleagues about your podcast and the ability for them to go, just like Trump does with social media, right to their constituencies?
Rep. August Pfluger:
We have thousands of followers after starting this from the ground. We started it this year, and they love the ability to go talk in a long form interview about the news of the day, the things that are happening, the legislation that they’re sponsoring, because they’re proud of it, and it’s good conservative policy that they’re able to talk about. That’s what the RSC really does well as we champion conservative policy, and we have the ear of the Speaker, who will be my next guest on this amazing podcast, and we’re able to go to him and say, ‘this is what your members are saying. This is what they want.’ Reconciliation was a perfect example of that. We pushed the Speaker and the Majority Leader and, quite frankly, the White House, in the direction of conservatism.
Washington Reporter:
You live closer to Joe Rogan in Texas than I do here. Is that someone who you listen to yourself, and how does the 2024 election and the significance that podcasts clearly had, especially in the home stretch of that, fit into what you’re talking about?
Rep. August Pfluger:
The audience of these, sources, podcast or otherwise, are tired of being told something that isn’t true; they want to hear it directly from the source and make their own judgment and their own decisions. President Trump knew that, and that’s why he harnessed Joe Rogan’s podcast and so many others. He knew that his message, not ABC’s message, his message, was going to get out, and then the electorate, the population, the citizens of this great country, could make the decision. That’s the difference. I think it used to be that way when we had nightly news and it was one hour of news each day. The news channels brought the news with a high journalistic standard. They allowed the American public to make the choice. Now it’s a spin. It’s a narrative. It’s not actually what people are saying. It’s some sort of spin, which is the difference.
Washington Reporter:
We recently had an event with Senator Eric Schmidt where he set, in essence, the over/under on the government shutdown ending at November 1st. Not he’s not putting any money on it. But as you think about the off ramp to this, how would this end? Your colleagues want to get back to doing hearings and things like that. There’s an election in Virginia and New Jersey next week. It seems like it’s not going to end before then. But what needs to happen other than having a couple Senate Democrats vote for the CR that you passed for this to actually end?
Rep. August Pfluger:
Katherine Clark said it perfectly. She said American families are struggling, and that that’s the Democrats’ leverage point. So that right there tells me that the reason that they’re doing this is because they believe this is the only way to stop Donald Trump, and meanwhile, he’s overseas negotiating peace deals that are historic. He is negotiating trade deals that are historic, and he’s not stopping. I don’t think it ends before November 1st. I think when the Senator said that, that was probably a good over under but I think it probably goes just prior to the mid-November pay period for the military.
Washington Reporter:
You’re in Congress now, but can you talk about what a shutdown does to military families and look at it from a military morale standpoint? Take us back to when you were living through one of these and what you’ve heard from people who are currently in the armed forces.
Rep. August Pfluger:
Let’s just go to the first question: my wife asked me, when we were going through a shutdown, ‘are we going to get a paycheck?’ That was the question that she asked when I was in the military, and I’m an officer with multiple years of service, and I’m getting paid a fair wage. And my answer was, ‘I don’t know.’ And so that immediately draws your attention to your wife and your kids and your family, where flying that F-22, that multi-million dollar aircraft, is no longer my main objective. It is, ‘can I put food on the table this month?’ And that’s a hard question for anyone to have to answer to their spouse. What about the soldier who’s deployed right now to the Middle East or to the Pacific or somewhere else, who has a new baby at home that is getting the same question like that? It is heartbreaking that our military personnel are having to answer that question to their spouses. How disrespectful is it of my Democrat colleagues to force them into that situation? Republicans didn’t do that right under Joe Biden. We wanted to end all of his his spending policies, but we did not shut down the government.
Washington Reporter:
Doug Burgum pointed out to me in our interview that China’s not shut down. Russia’s not shut down. The United States government is, in some ways, shut down. Trump obviously is busy overseas, making peace deals and trade deals. But what message do you think that right now Senate Democrats in particular, are sending to American adversaries who are working as the day is long right now, while the legislative branch of America, has kind of ground to a halt?
Rep. August Pfluger:
Unfortunately, they’re signaling our vulnerabilities and our weaknesses, and the weakness is in the ability for the radical sides of the parties to influence the adults in the room, and that’s exposing them to a tremendous amount of misinformation. And if you don’t think that Russia is taking advantage of this and using every form of of media, or social media or bots or whatever it is, to stir up the radical left base, they absolutely are. This has long been known. Just go watch the movie Reagan. It’s long been known that the Soviet Union knew that the way to win was to divide our country. So I am calling on my Democrat colleagues, especially those that served, to do the right thing, to stand up and do the right thing. And yes, that seems hard to do right now, but that’s the only way our country is going to heal: do the right thing to push back against that radical side
Washington Reporter:
You’re talking about the Democrats in Congress who served in the military. Are they freezing you out right now during the shutdown? Are they saying, ‘we don’t like what’s happening, but we’ve got to do what Schumer and Pelosi are telling us.’ How are they viewing this?
Rep. August Pfluger:
It’s a great question. I’m not sure it’s something that I can answer, but it’s something that they have the answer for, and I want them to push back on that radical side, push back on the people who are supporting Mamdani, that Marxist who is about to be elected in New York City, push back on all those principles. Let’s have normal fights. This is not a normal fight. Let’s have normal conversations, normal arguments. Let’s discuss the things that are normal, but shutting down the government over a budget that you passed, that your party’s president passed, is not normal.
Washington Reporter:
I want to end with Texas, that’s a big energy state. Look at permitting reform, for example, a lot of these people who are handing out permits are furloughed. How is this impacting energy and American energy independence?
Rep. August Pfluger:
Every day that this goes on makes it harder and harder for the bureaucracy to function, because in addition to the military not getting a paycheck, the people who work at the Department of Interior, they’re not getting a paycheck, and they’re the ones who approve these permits, and they’re the ones that approve the ability to have pipelines transit the country. So yes, it’s going to have an impact, just like not having a flood insurance policy so that you can close on a home somewhere is going to have an impact, just like those 42 million Americans that receive SNAP benefits are going to be worried about that. I was talking to a food bank today that services over 20 counties, and they’re very worried about the 55,000 people who come to that food bank, because these are real situations where, if that funding runs out, that food bank doesn’t have the resources to feed those people.
Washington Reporter:
Zooming in on Texas’s 11th District, who do you see this harming your constituents the most?
Rep. August Pfluger:
It’s going to be the military and SNAP benefits. Those are the top two that I’m seeing right now that are tremendously difficult.
Washington Reporter:
Congressman, from a new media outlet to a podcaster, thanks so much for your time today.